The 3DO the best 32-bit CD system?

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The 3DO the best 32-bit CD system?

Post by T2KFreeker » Tue Feb 27, 2007 8:20 am

Okay, so I admit it, I am a 3DO whore! Mind you, I can actually say that I love the Saturn and hate the Playstation, but where does the 3DO sit in the 32-bit arena? Easy to say, it is easily the best that there is. Mind you, I really believe thatif the Saturn would have had the same support in the US it had overseas in Japan, this might have changed my opinion, but in the US, what more do you want? The system was studly, and sat in a strange bracket that people were not expecting to see. The system literally sat in between the flirtation between three different "Future" gaming models. FMV, Digital Capture, and full on 3D Polygons. The cool thing? The 3DO could do it all, and in FMV areas, better than anyone at the time, and even kills the allmighty PSX. The bad thing? The developers had really no clue what in the hell to do with the power of the 3DO. This is seriosuly obvious when you really see what released on the system. It is sad because I worked at Game dude and the two systems I tried to sell the most were the 3DO and the Jaguar, depending on what you were looking for. I hate the fact that people looked at me like I was on crack or something as they were raped by Sega and Nintendo, but what did I kn ow? I was just a lowly videogame nerd in a videogame store that actually played what was there. I liked the 32-X, but knew it would be trumped by the upcoming Saturn, Cared less about the Playstation as I had no clue what in the Hell it was, and really saw nothing in the Nintendo camp. In the end, what was I to do? Simply speaking; If you were into carts, the Jaguar had the best potential for what you were looking for at the time. If you wanted to move on to CD's, the 3DO was king. I kept this up for as long as i could too. I wish to God that these systems had caught on too as i just am still bummed over the alternative. The fact that the PSX turned out as King makes me want to puke every time I see the Playstation logo. That system has about as much personality as a popcicle. Yeah, I guess it tastes good at the moment, but it melts away and sucks ass at the end of it all, and something new is always there to take it's place at the end. Get your money out, the Ice Cream man is coming.
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Post by Trev » Tue Feb 27, 2007 7:56 pm

Heh heh ... I like the popsicle analogy. Don't forget the taste and feeling of the wooden stick against your tongue (blech!) I actually got enjoyment out of PS1 (not as much as 3DO mind you) but I thought PS2 was/is way overrated.

I'm not sure if many would agree w/your Jaguar comments. I actually like it better now, than I did in the mid 90's. Too bad some of the better software wasn't available at launch (3DO suffered a similar problem) :(

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Post by UnholyTancred » Tue Feb 27, 2007 10:35 pm

I don't agree but I really do like the 3DO. The Saturn would be my favorite. I love it with all my heart but I hate the fact that I'll never be able to play so many good games unless I learn Japanese.

I'm not a huge fan of the Playstation. The Final Fantasy series went to the crapper. They became so easy and the story concentrated on a forced nonsensical romance which I hated so much. Tactics was the exception though and that game was awesome. Besides that, Metal Gear Solid, Blood Omen, and maybe a few RPG's there's very little that interests me on the Playstation.
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Post by T2KFreeker » Tue Feb 27, 2007 11:44 pm

I wish that we would have seen the Blood Omen: Legacy Of Kain version for the 3DO. Too bad it only made it inot the Alpha stages. Companies like Crystal Dynamics could have saved the 3DO from the fate that it suffered. Sad in the end as the system is really a monster that never got unleashed.
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Post by 3DOKid » Wed Feb 28, 2007 12:28 am

T2KFreeker wrote:I wish that we would have seen the Blood Omen: Legacy Of Kain version for the 3DO. Too bad it only made it inot the Alpha stages. Companies like Crystal Dynamics could have saved the 3DO from the fate that it suffered. Sad in the end as the system is really a monster that never got unleashed.
I never knew Blood Omen made it to Alpha on the 3DO - I love the PS1 version. In fact I have my original version that I have ISO'd and converted to run on my hacked PSP, so I've been playing it on the way to work - a brilliant game. Better than all the 3D sequels!

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Post by Mobius » Wed Feb 28, 2007 1:53 am

Long live the Saturn!

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Post by T2KFreeker » Wed Feb 28, 2007 2:15 am

Mobius wrote:Long live the Saturn!
Hey now, I love my Saturn as well, but just something about the 3DO is awesome. Probably because it is an underdog system all the way. Either way, I still love these games and the system. Fun stuff totally.
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Post by zenkov » Thu Mar 01, 2007 3:15 am

Saturn, and PlayStation.

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Post by Lemmi » Sat Jul 14, 2007 7:53 pm

another Jag vs 3DO thread just popped up at atariage :)

http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.ph ... pic=110229
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Re: The 3DO the best 32-bit CD system?

Post by NikeX » Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:22 pm

Iron Soldier on Jaguar does have the gameplay and graphics I liked.
Yes, no textures. Looks really like (TRON) virtual reality. As in the past
people thought "interactive movies are the future" today they think "the
better the graphics the more advanced the games" - both is not true.
Spend money and time doing graphics - means less time and money
for interactive elements. That's why everything we do in games is
shooting, walking, driving, etc...
However, the PSX wins both categories: Interactivity and graphics.
Last edited by NikeX on Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:23 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: The 3DO the best 32-bit CD system?

Post by NikeX » Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:22 pm

--

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Re: The 3DO the best 32-bit CD system?

Post by pitsunami » Sat Jul 14, 2007 8:29 pm

NikeX wrote:However, the PSX wins both categories: Interactivity and graphics.
:?: :?: :o

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Post by 3DOKid » Sat Jul 14, 2007 9:27 pm

The Playstation was my second love after the 3DO. A mate of mine had a Japanese import one and we played Ridge Racer in black and white, because, well, that's what happened when you plugged an import machine into a UK TV.

The Jaguar must have been less powerful than the 3DO. Argue the toss all you want. Granted Iron Soldier looked good, as did AvP, but things like Club Drive and Cybermorph looked massively inferior to NFS, Spacehulk, and even Total Eclipse. Not to mention WCIII. 3DO games looked miles better. What greater proof do you need?

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Post by T2KFreeker » Sat Jul 14, 2007 10:50 pm

3DOKid wrote:The Playstation was my second love after the 3DO. A mate of mine had a Japanese import one and we played Ridge Racer in black and white, because, well, that's what happened when you plugged an import machine into a UK TV.

The Jaguar must have been less powerful than the 3DO. Argue the toss all you want. Granted Iron Soldier looked good, as did AvP, but things like Club Drive and Cybermorph looked massively inferior to NFS, Spacehulk, and even Total Eclipse. Not to mention WCIII. 3DO games looked miles better. What greater proof do you need?
Wait just a darn minute there cowboy! The Jaguar really is a much more powerful system than the 3DO You can't compare a last generation game like Need For Speed on 3DO to a launch title for the Jaguar, that is crazy. It's like comparing Castlevania to Dracula X, it is an unfair judgement call. Hell, I wouldn't even compare say Battlesphere to Star Blade, just don't add up. The only thing the 3DO has over the Jaguar, and this is truth mind you spec wise, is the ability to run MPEG video instead of Cinepak. The problem with the Jaguar was that Atari did not want to spend money developing games as the Tremeils were cheap bastards, that's it. Just look at games like Rayman or Battlemorph. Cybermorph was a 2 Meg launch title and it still does something that no game at the time of release did, you can litterally go anywhere in the game. It's not on rails, which was awesome at the time. Want to talk graphics? Look at the two DOOM's. Okay, the 3DO version has awesoem music and the Jaguar version has no music during gameplay. 3DO wins there and only there. Jaguar is full screen and runs at 30 fps with full resolution grapics where as the 3DO version runs at 10 to 15 fps (Sometimes) and is like half the size of your TV screen and is still choppy as all hell.
Not that I want to get into a big debate here, but if Atari had put more time and money into the Jaguar games, and third party had made original games instead of porting everything over from the Genesis and SNES, the Jaguar would have had much better games in the graphics department. Have you ever seen Iron Soldier 2 or Towers II? World Tour Racing? IWAR was another really well done game and it was only a 4 meg cart. There really was some great stuff n the Jaguar as well as the 3DO. Personally, I love both systems.
This is a stick up! Put all of your 3DO games in the bag and nobody gets hurt!

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Post by 3DOKid » Sat Jul 14, 2007 11:06 pm

Nerve touched? (again?)

I'm joking. Of cause. (Am I? Grrrr!)

...but ask anyone, absolutely anyone, and all the best looking games were on the 3DO. (anyone around here that is, that doesn't want to get banned! ;) )

I'll see your Doom, which was badly converted by Art Data, in fact it was mauled by Art Data, and raise you a Space Hulk, or PO'ed, or Road Rash, or, or, or Killing Time (FPS' aren't my thing)

Also, Cybermorph hasn't the best draw distance. I could code a free roaming game, if it was acceptable to have a draw distance shorter than 3 feet.

And yes, Battlesphere gets plenty of love. I'd love to love it. but it was made in 2000? That's not fair. And costs more money than everything. (And that's a lot!)

The Jag is a filthy putrid games console. (I said that for effect) but Pitfall and POwer Drive are by far the best.

Iron soldier should have been a 3DO game. (It needed textures!) and Tower II is no better than Slayer*












*May not be true as I have never player Tower II.

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Post by Lemmi » Sun Jul 15, 2007 12:09 am

T2KFreeker wrote:Wait just a darn minute there cowboy! The Jaguar really is a much more powerful system than the 3DO .
then why not say this at atariage? :lol:
http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.ph ... pic=110229
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Post by Lemmi » Sun Jul 15, 2007 12:16 am

Ex-3DO collector extraordinaire , but i still have my collection
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Post by T2KFreeker » Sun Jul 15, 2007 1:17 am

Lemmi wrote:
T2KFreeker wrote:Wait just a darn minute there cowboy! The Jaguar really is a much more powerful system than the 3DO .
then why not say this at atariage? :lol:
http://www.atariage.com/forums/index.ph ... pic=110229
Because I try to stay away from Atari Age. Too many polotics for my taste. Truthfully speaking, I worked at a videogame store when both systems were out and I actually sprung the $700.00 for the 3DO, which I can say was a dumb thing to do. I liked the system mind you, but I should have been saving money. I tried to sell both systems and actually had people looking at both. In the end, they would go for the Jaguar if they bought either of them simply because of the price. Hell, Gamedude refused to stock the Goldstar 3DO unit new because of all the problems it had. I tend to generally agree with GORF though when he talks about the Jaguar as he has programmed for it. He has even figured out stuff on the machine that idiots that worked at Atari at the time swore could never be done. He's generally a good guy who knows what he is doing with the machine.
Most of the people at Atari Age are upright against the Jaguar right out the door as they really think it killed Atari. This ain't true. The Tremeils killed Atari because they rushed the Jaguar into the market with no good developement tools at all and that is that. Couple this with the fact that they didn't want to spend real money on the games and you can see why the Jaguar failed. Jaguar failed for the same reasons Lynx failed. Lynx was bad ass and still is today. Still, Atari abandond the machine way too early and really didn't help with the programming side of the system, although it was easier to program for than Jaguar was. Saturn suffered from the same problems as Jaguar programming wise except that Sega was smart and had several programming kits and tons of libraries ready upon launch.
What killed 3DO? Lack of power? Of course not, but that horses ass Trip Hawkins and his "People will get a second and third job to be able to play videogames" theory was what killed it in the end. It's being proven right now with Sony and the PS3. NOBODY that lives in the real world and is stuck an a bidget wants to pay that much for a console, no matter how bad ass it is.
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Post by 3DOKid » Sun Jul 15, 2007 7:37 am

I love Trip Hawkins :( (he's not my dad by the way!) and I have PS3. :(

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Post by Mobius » Sun Jul 15, 2007 3:03 pm

Lemmi wrote:heh check this article out

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... i_14414478
Wow, this site is awesome... I love reading some of these old mid-90s video game articles!

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Post by Lemmi » Sun Jul 15, 2007 5:03 pm

Mobius wrote:
Lemmi wrote:heh check this article out

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... i_14414478
Wow, this site is awesome... I love reading some of these old mid-90s video game articles!
isnt it amazing what you can find when you put jaguar vs 3do into google :D
i spent a good hour on that site reading old videogame articles for all kinds of systems

like this one for the Saturn :)
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... i_17008483
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Post by Mobius » Sun Jul 15, 2007 7:02 pm

Lemmi wrote:
Mobius wrote:
Lemmi wrote:heh check this article out

http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... i_14414478
Wow, this site is awesome... I love reading some of these old mid-90s video game articles!
isnt it amazing what you can find when you put jaguar vs 3do into google :D
i spent a good hour on that site reading old videogame articles for all kinds of systems

like this one for the Saturn :)
http://findarticles.com/p/articles/mi_m ... i_17008483
Add in Atari's 32-bit Jaguar system, and the playing field is getting pretty crowded.
Oh, snap!

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Post by T2KFreeker » Sun Jul 15, 2007 7:20 pm

3DOKid wrote:I love Trip Hawkins :( (he's not my dad by the way!) and I have PS3. :(
Well, sorry man. I didn't say anything inherently bad about Trip Hawkins who I know isn't your Dad. I am just saying it was a bad move to make the 3DO so expensive. As for the PS3? Sorry man, I can't justify anything there man, I still think it's a piece of garbage. To each their own as I am sure that you and the other four proplr that could afford it enjoy it! :lol:
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Post by 3DOKid » Sun Jul 15, 2007 10:54 pm

You know? I love you right? I count everyone on the board my friend. And you can say what you want!

The Ps3 has been alright. In my house the rule is one console beneath TV. My 3DO, Saturn, PS2, N64, etc., are all up stairs in the 'pit' I call the computer room. The PS3 is sat next to the telly. Pride of place where the PS2 was.

The PS3 is expensive, other than that it has been OK. Media streaming, backward compatibility, online, it's been OK. I just can't bring myself to back Microsoft. I've worked in I.T. for 13 years, and I just can't bring myself to say anything nice about MS at all. Sony are arrogant yadda, yadda, yadda. but MS make cheap, second rate products. Always have, always will. Gates is an idiot. Still - the 360 has some games, and well,
the ps3 don't.

And Nintendo is, well, gay.

I don't want this forum to descend into a Sony are TEH LOZERS - and like wise MS and Ninty.

I'm sure everyone here has their alliances, but we're all 3DO right?

I'm looking forward to M2 release. ;)

The clue is in the name!

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Post by T2KFreeker » Mon Jul 16, 2007 1:03 am

3DOKid wrote:You know? I love you right? I count everyone on the board my friend. And you can say what you want!

The Ps3 has been alright. In my house the rule is one console beneath TV. My 3DO, Saturn, PS2, N64, etc., are all up stairs in the 'pit' I call the computer room. The PS3 is sat next to the telly. Pride of place where the PS2 was.

The PS3 is expensive, other than that it has been OK. Media streaming, backward compatibility, online, it's been OK. I just can't bring myself to back Microsoft. I've worked in I.T. for 13 years, and I just can't bring myself to say anything nice about MS at all. Sony are arrogant yadda, yadda, yadda. but MS make cheap, second rate products. Always have, always will. Gates is an idiot. Still - the 360 has some games, and well,
the ps3 don't.

And Nintendo is, well, gay.

I don't want this forum to descend into a Sony are TEH LOZERS - and like wise MS and Ninty.

I'm sure everyone here has their alliances, but we're all 3DO right?

I'm looking forward to M2 release. ;)

The clue is in the name!

3DO Kid!
Hey man, it's all good dude. I don't take stuff personally like that! As for the PS3 vs Microsoft thing, well, it is what it is. As for Nintendo Wii, I got one word for you; Nights. If it acvtually does come out and is anything like the Saturn game, I am all over it. I currently have no next generation systems as I haven't seen any real reason for one yet. I have all of Last Gens systems from Dreamcast to XBOX. All have their strong points, even the Gamecube and PS2. None of them are my favorite system of all time though which really is a tie between 3DO and Jaguar. If I could make a system that would run them both I'd be in heaven game wise. Either way, I consider these talks as discussions as I hope everyone else here does. I stay away from Atari Age with this stuff because it always ends up as a flame war and I am so tired of it. They seem to not happen here, which is awesome and keeps me happy!

3DO Rocks. Always has and always will. 8)
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Post by bonefish » Mon Jul 16, 2007 5:19 am

It all breaks down into several simple comparison statements (I left out the N64 as it was late to the game) I'd like to think

3d Processing:
Playstation>Saturn>3do>Jaguar
Why?:Playstation pushes more polygons as we all know. Saturn could do more than the 3do which I would think neither were never pushed to their limits (3do never seems to "peak" out during its shelf life, maybe it lies close to saturn capabilities). Jaguar games were textureless wonders, looking more like snes super-fx games.

2d Processing:
Saturn>3do>Jaguar>=Playstation
Why?:The Saturn had some really impressive 2d games, as did the 3do. The Playstation had some terrible 2d capabilities, as shown in 2d fighter ports that it and the Saturn shared.

Games:
Playstation>3do>=Saturn>Jaguar
Why?:The Playstation had a huge library of games, modern day NES one would say. Although it had tons of crap, good stuff was abundant. As for the 3do vs. Saturn, I bought a 3do and bought lots of games and played through them all, I've had many of hours of entertainment. The Saturn on the other hand, I haven't even came close, but the arcade ports are nice. The Jaguar? Alien vs Predator? Yeah...

Sound:
3do>=Playstation>Saturn>Jaguar
I choose the 3do over the rest because it uses the rear channels on 5.1 regularly which seems to never happen on any of the rest.

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Post by Gir Draxa » Mon Jul 16, 2007 6:44 am

Hey, remember the 3DO was pioneering in a lot of uncharted territory. For Example : Anyone else remember 3DO's venture into interactive set-top box for cable tv. (It'd be intresting find the Scientific Atlanta boxes from Omaha. Yes?)

They had a lot going for them, just they had mistakes others learned from. Being the pioneers in their field, they had no one to learn from. Edutainment titles and multimedia presentations are not big sellers... but sales reps will try to tell you they are.

Lots of good ideas, does not a good system make. If the titles are boring, aren't properly promoted (Sega I'm looking at you!) or are too expensive (or coupled with a hellaciously expensive system compared to the competitors), you're not going to have the system life you want. I still remember the 3DO reps' quote when I talked to them the day of the system cancellation, "Our system has had a comparably long life"... well, compared to a Virtual Boy or 32X, I guess they're right.

3DO was underappreciated, and berated in mags like Gamepro (who really was a paid hitman. They'd bad review storm any game/system for a fee. "review? who needs to play it to review it?... we got our fee!") Had it been more well received at it's start by programmers, perhaps the tools would have been developed to make it shine to it's full potential. It would have at least eclipsed Saturn or (blue skying here) perhaps even won over Sega to dev for them instead of wasting time with the Saturn. :)


Ah well, my rant on the subject.
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Post by T2KFreeker » Mon Jul 16, 2007 6:28 pm

bonefish wrote:It all breaks down into several simple comparison statements (I left out the N64 as it was late to the game) I'd like to think

3d Processing:
Playstation>Saturn>3do>Jaguar
Why?:Playstation pushes more polygons as we all know. Saturn could do more than the 3do which I would think neither were never pushed to their limits (3do never seems to "peak" out during its shelf life, maybe it lies close to saturn capabilities). Jaguar games were textureless wonders, looking more like snes super-fx games.

2d Processing:
Saturn>3do>Jaguar>=Playstation
Why?:The Saturn had some really impressive 2d games, as did the 3do. The Playstation had some terrible 2d capabilities, as shown in 2d fighter ports that it and the Saturn shared.

Games:
Playstation>3do>=Saturn>Jaguar
Why?:The Playstation had a huge library of games, modern day NES one would say. Although it had tons of crap, good stuff was abundant. As for the 3do vs. Saturn, I bought a 3do and bought lots of games and played through them all, I've had many of hours of entertainment. The Saturn on the other hand, I haven't even came close, but the arcade ports are nice. The Jaguar? Alien vs Predator? Yeah...

Sound:
3do>=Playstation>Saturn>Jaguar
I choose the 3do over the rest because it uses the rear channels on 5.1 regularly which seems to never happen on any of the rest.
Hmm, I disagree with some of the things that you bring up man. As for 3D muscle, we will really never know which was more powerful between the Saturn and 3DO because the Saturn especially was never pushed to its limits at all. Remember, they used the dual processor approach to things which is very much the same as the Jaguar did which killed them. Even Sega will tell you that the really never tapped the full potential of the Saturn, not even close.

As for 2D stuff, have you seen Rayman on the Jaguar? Kills the Playstation and Saturn versions. If we are talking specs here, the system murdered the Playstation and could have sat with the 3DO and Neo Geo as all three systems had very close to the same specs. If only MK3 had released, we would know for sure. Anyway, the Jaguar killed the PSX in 2D by a longshot.
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Post by wulfren » Mon Jul 16, 2007 9:45 pm

First off I wanna say I love reading threads like this, to actually "hear" what people thing is priceless, especially when it comes to subject so close to my heart. ...having said that i'm going to be the odd man out and say

that while yes I seriously have a certain place for the 3DO, I actually don't hold one over the other. I hold each system to its individual merits and honestly on a personal level each system has its own set of feelings & memories.

To me, just as its not fair to compare the Xbox 360 to the 3DO it too isn't fair to compare alot of old technology to each other. IE the Virtua boy was different, but couldn't be compared to anything else because there was no other system that tried to do what it did (and for good reason too) I know i know there was a whole set of systems competing at the time to be the best of the best, the saturn, PSX 3DO ect ect, and while they were all wanting the same title they all took different approaches to get there. To me thats where I can appreciate each for what it was.


Now having said that with exception to maybe the PS3 (which is Sony's answer to the 360 w/ some over kill options) you can still say thats true to the systems of today

case & point

Xbox 360 can deliver some very stunning graphics's and game play that would keep you strapped to your seat for hours on end.

However the Wii while it offers very good graphics's as well offers something much different, you are actually involved physically with the game with the Wii mote you throw the punches in boxing, or you hit the grand slam in baseball, just like you would in real life.


and the situation goes on & on, the PSP offers you nice graphics's you can watch a certain amount of movies with it. where as with the DS you have 2 screens to use for the games, not exactly the same level of graphics you feel a bit more involved using the stylus on a touch screen rather than just hitting buttons



This is just my thoughts tho

Wulf
Wulfren

~Lupine Nobilis~

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3DOKid
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Post by 3DOKid » Mon Jul 16, 2007 10:49 pm

Breathren Wulfren!

(maybe all posts should be started like that!)

3DO is better than the 360 because my 3DO is 13 years old and has never crashed, never chewed a disc and still brings me hours of joy. Sorta.

I quite fancy Gears of War on the 360 and PGR3, but, at which point, things get kind of dry. Maybe Dead Rising. But the 3DO? I'm actually looking forward to Powerslide. Eagerly looking forward to it if I'm honest. And the other games too. There is not one PS3/360/Wii game that fills me with same excitement. Honestly? Maybe MGS4. Maybe Resident Evil 5. Assassins Creed looks OK too. but... meh. They are too complicated. And that's the problem. And they will charge me £50 a go anyway. ($100) I can get a hell of a jag and 3do collection for that! (if the Jag wasn't gay that is!)

The PSP? I commute and travel a lot with work. My hacked PSP saved my life. Or at least my sanity, of that I have no doubt.

Ninty? When 3DO was about and selling, Ninty were where Sony are. The big arrogant lawyer filled vengeful c*nts. And I haven't got past that mentally yet. Plus there happy smiley casual gamer games really irritate me to look at. You know what - I want to kill things in 3D. I was born in the 70s, with an extra chromosome: The bottom line is, I want to kill things. Even if it's just in 3D on a games console. And - I want to play the hero to - so none of that anti-hero 90s rubbish for me either.

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