3DO Amiga Atari Controller?

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AntiFreak
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3DO Amiga Atari Controller?

Post by AntiFreak » Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:21 pm

Hi all

I was wondering i want to use a c64 mouse on my 3do plug it in and nothing happens :-( is there any way to play 3do with genesis controller or everything else with a dv-9 that would be awsome.

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bitrate
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Post by bitrate » Tue Jun 21, 2011 9:27 pm

The 3DO has a proprietary bus for peripherals. You need to use the 3DO branded mouse.
For a Genesis pad, you need an adapter. SNES pad adapters are much easier to locate though.

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Post by AntiFreak » Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:06 pm

An adapter. but its the same DV-9 port. because of the order of the pins or what and can i use my 3DO pad on an atari

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Post by 3DO Experience » Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:12 pm

The way the Genesis pad works and the way the 3DO pad works are different. Think about it like English and French. They may use the same letters but the words are different.
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Post by AntiFreak » Tue Jun 21, 2011 10:37 pm

Ok i tested it out i can play my Atari 2600 with my 3DO pad but it don work reversed. But you can play a genesis with an atari pad (playing sonic with atari controller kicks ass).and reversed and the c 64 mouse works on a genesis too . Why the hell does it not work on a 3DO
Its a normal DV9 port as i sayd. but it works just the 3DO pad. there mus be a lock chip or something.
Strange

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Post by Austin » Wed Jun 22, 2011 12:21 am

/facepalm

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Post by 3DO Experience » Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:55 am

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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Wed Jun 22, 2011 2:47 am

Thats a "DB9" port, not a DV9 port. Also known as an RS232 port, or serial port.

The Atari and the Sega use pin 8 as GND, and when any of the other pins get grounded, you get that function.

The 3DO pad uses a proprietary form of serial comunication for the controller, which is why you can use 8 of them and it will know which is which, and also has stereo audio in the pads, and it can do this with only 9 pins cause it is a "SERIAL" connection.

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Post by Calavera » Wed Jun 22, 2011 5:55 am

So it is possible to use a 3DO controller on the Genesis? I assumed it wouldn't work since Genesis won't work on 3DO due power actually traveling through the cable and whatnot. Just curious, I have controllers for my genesis and wouldn't be using a 3DO controller on it, just wondering if it is possible.
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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Wed Jun 22, 2011 9:02 am

Read what i posted again.

NO NO NO, it WONT work...

1 is serial, one is direct connection... Power travels through BOTH of them...

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Post by AntiFreak » Wed Jun 22, 2011 1:07 pm

LOLz the mouse does not have a "daisy chain port", and that works after all the trouble i moded my c64 mouse so it don´t have connection to pin 5, now it works. I play 3DO with a c 64 mouse. IN YOUR FACE lolz.

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Post by 3DOKid » Wed Jun 22, 2011 6:31 pm

steady on.

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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:15 am

AntiFreak wrote:LOLz the mouse does not have a "daisy chain port", and that works after all the trouble i moded my c64 mouse so it don´t have connection to pin 5, now it works. I play 3DO with a c 64 mouse. IN YOUR FACE lolz.
With that attitude, dont expect anyone to give up their free time to help you again.

And read the post i was replying to. But you think what you like.

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Post by Calavera » Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:33 am

CasetheCorvetteman wrote:Read what i posted again.

NO NO NO, it WONT work...

1 is serial, one is direct connection... Power travels through BOTH of them...
Was that in response to my will a 3DO controller work on a Genesis system?
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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Thu Jun 23, 2011 10:32 am

Mostly mate yeah

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Post by bitrate » Thu Jun 23, 2011 7:18 pm

AntiFreak wrote:LOLz the mouse does not have a "daisy chain port", and that works after all the trouble i moded my c64 mouse so it don´t have connection to pin 5, now it works. I play 3DO with a c 64 mouse. IN YOUR FACE lolz.


Hold up just a second.

You came in here not understanding how a simple contact-closure switching device (Genesis) would not work on a console utilizing a serial communication protocol. Now, seemingly, you have figured out how to merge the disparate signaling protocols between a Commodore mouse released in the mid 1980's and the 3DO console released nearly a decade later.


So, assuming you found someone else to help you figure out how to modify your C64 mouse (not impossible, but unlikely), let's have a closer look at your setup.
(I'm also going to assume you have the 1351 mouse and not the 1350, as the 1350 does not support proportional mode and would be even more of a challenge to directly connect to the 3DO.)

So, all of this magic was accomplished by lifting pin 5. The 3DO control port specifies that pins 2 and 5 output Vcc (+5Vdc).
Pin 5 of the C64 mouse is unused in Joystick mode and corresponds to the Y-Position in Proportional mode.
So, you have effectively removed the ability of the mouse to communicate Y-Position information. The feature of scrolling in a 2-dimensional plane is overrated anyway.

There is a bigger problem though. The C64 mouse is an active device and as such is expecting to receive power. As I said earlier, pins 2 and 5 of the 3DO's DB-9 port carry +5Vdc. You have disconnected pin 5 (which is not a power input pin anyway) so all that is left is pin 2.
Pin 2 of the C64 mouse corresponds to "Down" in Joystick mode and is unused in proportional mode. So, it looks like we won't be powering the mouse.

In case you are interested, pin 7 on the C64 mouse is the power input pin. Unfortunately, pin 7 on the 3DO port is the clock.

There are MANY other SERIOUS incompatibility issues between a C64 mouse and the 3DO, but I think that the above will suffice.


How did you put it? Oh yeah... Lolz.

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Post by Jones » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:36 pm

:D

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Post by 3DO Experience » Thu Jun 23, 2011 8:53 pm

*sits back and smiles*
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Post by 3DOKid » Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:23 pm

pfft.

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Post by NikeX » Thu Jun 23, 2011 9:55 pm

AntiFreak wrote:LOLz the mouse does not have a "daisy chain port", and that works after all the trouble i moded my c64 mouse so it don´t have connection to pin 5, now it works. I play 3DO with a c 64 mouse. IN YOUR FACE lolz.
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Post by AntiFreak » Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:38 am

So
It is a 1351 I´t doesnt has Anything to do with the voltage every little port
(usb, Standart seriel, ps2, goes on and on and on). 1. It doesnt have to do with the time an amiga 1200 use an old pcmcia but you can use a cardreader from 2010. 2. The voltage doesnt have to do with anything a snes pad has no daisy chaining and uses 5V too. The 3DO pad is based on the snes pad what means you can use a moddet snes mouse on a 3DO (theoretic) and a modded C64 mouse. The nakitek pad works on a snes and a Genesis And the 3do is based on a snes pad. And the nakitek pad works on a 3do too (some buttons are twisted). okay what i´m trying to tell the 3DO port isn´t Special in any way with a bit tricking is it possible to use any DB9 device on a 3DO.
And the C64 mouse works but i have to say i doesnt realy know which port doesnt have connection. it is the 5th IN the mouse not at the port.
And most important i am a trained Computer technician. I´m studying right now im know what i´m talking about. and i have a huge collection of consoles and some of the are moddet by myself ( portable genesis model 3).
Think about it and may test it by yourself

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Post by AntiFreak » Fri Jun 24, 2011 1:39 am

oh and the mouse mode is a software thing it doesn´t have to do anything with the hardware!!!!! !

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Post by bitrate » Fri Jun 24, 2011 5:49 am

I'll make a few points below, but I'm not going to argue with you ad nauseam (partly because I can barely decipher what you have written). Trained computer technician or not, you have plainly displayed your electronic knowledge in your first couple of posts in this thread. Talking about lock-out chips and not understanding that just because two devices share a common physical connection type does not guarantee any other communication standard speaks volumes about your level of understanding.


AntiFreak wrote:I´t doesnt has Anything to do with the voltage...
Voltage level, polarity, and in this case, pin assignment, are actually important believe it or not.

AntiFreak wrote:The voltage doesnt have to do with anything a snes pad has no daisy chaining and uses 5V too.
At no point did I outline a relationship between a devices ability to be daisy-chained and its operating voltage.
AntiFreak wrote:okay what i´m trying to tell the 3DO port isn´t Special in any way...
Well, apart from it being proprietary.

AntiFreak wrote: ...with a bit tricking is it possible to use any DB9 device on a 3DO.
I agree. Emulating a 3DO peripheral in hardware or software is a fairly straightforward process once you understand the 3DO peripheral port interface.


AntiFreak wrote:And the C64 mouse works but i have to say i doesnt realy know which port doesnt have connection.

I must say, you have taken the road less traveled with this approach to circuit manipulation. I always like to know which part of a circuit I am disconnecting before doing so. I'm curious as to what prompted you into making a break at that particular point.

AntiFreak wrote:oh and the mouse mode is a software thing it doesn´t have to do anything with the hardware!!!!! !
An upgrade in hardware is what gave the 1351 the ability to do proportional control. Upon power up, proportional mode is selected by default unless the right mouse button is pressed. You can use as many exclamation points as you like, but if it didn't have anything to do with hardware they would have been selling software for the 1350 instead of designing a new mouse.

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