How much does the 3DO flight stick benefit gameplay??....

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How much does the 3DO flight stick benefit gameplay??....

Post by dave4shmups » Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:27 pm

I'm curious as to whether or not there would be any improvement using this flight stick in a game like Shockwave, which is brutally difficult, IMO. There are a lot of 3DO games where you can use the flight stick, so I'm wondering if it would be worth getting.

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Post by 3DOKid » Mon Apr 16, 2012 8:38 pm

I've had one for years. If I'm honest, it detracts from game play.

Analogue, IMHO, was one of those over sold features. It sort of nagged around during the 3DO era, but didn't properly arrive until the N64, Saturn and PS1. It was still shit then. The 1st Xbox probably nailed it, but Nintendo and Sony still don't get it, again in my honest opinion. But Xbox nailed it in the sense, it's all it can do. To play fighting games, you need a digital pad, but as far as console makers go, that simple fact: does not compute.

So, WTF, they have abandoned controllers completely with Wii, Kinect, and the Sony thing. When they should have really nailed VR but hey, no one listens to me.

Analogue is like those dickhead gamers that think online is the be-all-and-all. I mean it's fine and all, but they argue a case with no point, they argue it so very vocally, and when it arrives and the whole industry is obsessed with it, normal folk have to look at and say: why?

(I noticed our rant quota was down for the quarter)

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Post by Anonymous » Tue Apr 17, 2012 1:25 am

Ive only really used mine with WC3. It works well with that game

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Post by 3DOKid » Tue Apr 17, 2012 11:16 am

grimm wrote:Ive only really used mine with WC3. It works well with that game

well, yeah. :)

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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Tue Apr 17, 2012 2:55 pm

3DOKid wrote:I've had one for years. If I'm honest, it detracts from game play.

Analogue, IMHO, was one of those over sold features. It sort of nagged around during the 3DO era, but didn't properly arrive until the N64, Saturn and PS1.
But the N64 controller and the Saturn Arcade Racer were digital proportional in their original forms... Both have an optical sensor and a perforated disc ( two of in the case of the N64 pad ) to read movement. They arent analog.

The NegCon and the big Playstation dual stick were analog and so were the twin sticks on the pads. Not sure what the Saturn 3D pad has inside, ive never opened one up.

The Wii controller is a wonderful device. You can get the standard type controller for it too, if you want to play it that way, which i quite often do.

Although i agree with you in alot of what you say here though, i think the standard 3DO pad is great provided its the 2nd version Panasonic and not the first ( which is fine if you dont need the diagonals ) i think the best packed in standard video game console controller was and always will be the NEO-GEO controller from the AES. it was beyond compare for its day, and was PERFECT for the games made for the machine.

Never seen a flight stick for 3DO, used that big twin one on the PS1 for Star Fighter at one point, and didnt mind it, but i got back on the 3DO with the standard pad and could fly inches off the ground with ease again...

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Post by Austin » Tue Apr 17, 2012 7:07 pm

CasetheCorvetteman wrote:i think the standard 3DO pad is great provided its the 2nd version Panasonic and not the first ( which is fine if you dont need the diagonals )
Agreed. I don't bother with any other controller unless I am playing a fighting game. It's comfortable, responsive, and has a smooth feel to it. I like it.

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Post by Anonymous » Tue Apr 17, 2012 8:11 pm

Austin wrote:
CasetheCorvetteman wrote:i think the standard 3DO pad is great provided its the 2nd version Panasonic and not the first ( which is fine if you dont need the diagonals )
Agreed. I don't bother with any other controller unless I am playing a fighting game. It's comfortable, responsive, and has a smooth feel to it. I like it.
Are we talking the second revision of the first 3DO FZ-1 controller, with headphone jack, or are we talking the redesigned smaller 3DO FZ-10 controller?

Ive so far only had the first 3DO FZ-1 controller, and i like it, but the d-pad is not very nice at all. Diagonals are pretty much impossible with consistancy. That is better on the FZ-10 one. But i do remember reading that the FZ-1 revised controller had a better d-pad. Ive yet to find one though at a price thats worth it, since i want it boxed to be sure its the revised one, in the red/square-design box, and not the black one which is the first.. (if anyone has one for sale, please dont be afraid to contact me, it doesnt have to be boxed if you are sure its the second revision)

I do have a little suggestion though that does help the FZ-1 controller, loosen up the screws a little bit, and the membrane is more responsive letting the d-pad work a little better. At least thats my impression.

As for the original NEO GEO stick, its not perfect, not for people who prefer the western arcade outlay anyway. The buttons are in too steep an angle. Its not so bad you cant use it (its what i use since im NOT paying what people ask for custom joysticks, and i cant build it myself, and the second version seems worse to me), but it is somewhat uncomfortable in games where all 4 buttons are used frequently, as in fighters etc.

But, as for 3DO controllers, try hunting down a megadrive controller adaptor. It is worth it if you can find one, best d-pads in the business, both first-party and third-party, and there is usually one to be found that suits everyones handsize and taste.

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Post by vestcoat » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:09 am

Going back to the OP, I have a Flight Stick and I like it lot, but I haven't used it much. Each game seems to have a completely different calibration procedure and some of them aren't very intuitive, requiring digging through in-game menus or referencing the manual. I'm usually just too lazy to hook it up.

That said, the Flight Stick itself is an impressive unit - it ain't no Quickshot knockoff. The vertical and horizontal movement is completely independent, there's a port on the cord for a 2nd controller, and it's a heavy, full-sized device that doesn't tip over easily. I had a good time playing NFS and Rebel Assault with it.

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Post by Trev » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:20 am

I'd imagine that Blade Force would benefit quite a bit from the Flight stick, although I've never actually used it when playing. Flying Nightmares I'd wager would be improved quite a bit too, but I never play that game.
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Post by Austin » Wed Apr 18, 2012 12:28 am

grimm wrote:Are we talking the second revision of the first 3DO FZ-1 controller, with headphone jack, or are we talking the redesigned smaller 3DO FZ-10 controller?
FZ-10 controller.

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Post by JohnnyDude » Wed Apr 18, 2012 4:55 am

Star Fighter was a bit easier with the flight stick when I tried it. The regular controller input is just way too sensitive and the framerate too low. Bad combination.

Even so, all the games are easy enough with a regular controller, and I don't like the hassle of getting out the flight stick and calibrating the thing.

I half agree with 3DO Kid's rant about analogue. Even with modern de-facto controllers like PS2, I usually prefer the digital pad. To me the analogue stick feels like it is a cumbersomely long trek between going in one direction to another. 99% of the time I'm jamming the thing all the way to the edge, so the time it takes to move from one edge to the other is a waste. I know it's silly, but playing a game on a controller like that just feels more tiring. I thought the N64 and dreamcast analogue sticks were suitably small to avoid this.

And analogue buttons? Ugh. Now that's just irritating. Perhaps that was the analogue fad at its peak. I think some PS3 launch titles used this (like racing games) but I'm hoping the trend is dead. And I hate it when a game expects me to click the analogue stick down (like "L3" on a PS3 controller); I trust I'll never get the hang of that without feeling like I'm fumbling around.

My preference is probably just because I play a lot of emulated games. If you remember climbing walls in Ninja Gaiden for the NES, you may understand my preferences in a controller.

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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:10 am

grimm wrote:
Are we talking the second revision of the first 3DO FZ-1 controller, with headphone jack, or are we talking the redesigned smaller 3DO FZ-10 controller?

Ive so far only had the first 3DO FZ-1 controller, and i like it, but the d-pad is not very nice at all. Diagonals are pretty much impossible with consistancy. That is better on the FZ-10 one. But i do remember reading that the FZ-1 revised controller had a better d-pad. Ive yet to find one though at a price thats worth it, since i want it boxed to be sure its the revised one, in the red/square-design box, and not the black one which is the first.. (if anyone has one for sale, please dont be afraid to contact me, it doesnt have to be boxed if you are sure its the second revision)

I do have a little suggestion though that does help the FZ-1 controller, loosen up the screws a little bit, and the membrane is more responsive letting the d-pad work a little better. At least thats my impression.

As for the original NEO GEO stick, its not perfect, not for people who prefer the western arcade outlay anyway. The buttons are in too steep an angle. Its not so bad you cant use it (its what i use since im NOT paying what people ask for custom joysticks, and i cant build it myself, and the second version seems worse to me), but it is somewhat uncomfortable in games where all 4 buttons are used frequently, as in fighters etc.

But, as for 3DO controllers, try hunting down a megadrive controller adaptor. It is worth it if you can find one, best d-pads in the business, both first-party and third-party, and there is usually one to be found that suits everyones handsize and taste.
Im talking the smaller pad with the round little buttons in the middle. FZ-JP2? id have to pull one out to have a look at the number.

There was no FZ-1 pad and FZ-10 pad as such, cause the later smaller pad came with both the 1 and the 10 ( friend of mine has one, and only has the small pads, bought brand new way back in the day, small pad in the pic on the box too. ). I dont recall the headphone pad coming with the 10 though. I have one here somewhere.

The NEO-GEO stick IS perfect in my opinion, which is all me or anyone else can give, the button angle is spot on and couldnt be better. It allows the hands to rest with wrists at a nice natural and comfortable angle. All 4 buttons are in dead set perfect spots for my fingers and i wouldnt ever want it any other way. Ive got 3 of the 2nd gen sticks, dont like them at all for fighters, not too bad for shooters, first gen stick ive got 4 of, perfect in every way. Control pad with the NEO-CD feels awesome too for a pad, although i havent ever used it to play a game cause mine is brand new and i prefer sticks.

Your hands and playing styles will be different to mine, which is where we have our difference in opinions on what works well for us.

Mega Drive pads are indeed awesome controllers, as are Sega Saturn first generation and Japan version pads. I like both and have a few of each. I havent used the Dreamcast pad much, but not a huge fan of the analog triggers at all.

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Post by dave4shmups » Wed Apr 18, 2012 4:43 pm

JohnnyDude wrote:Star Fighter was a bit easier with the flight stick when I tried it. The regular controller input is just way too sensitive and the framerate too low. Bad combination.

Even so, all the games are easy enough with a regular controller, and I don't like the hassle of getting out the flight stick and calibrating the thing.

I half agree with 3DO Kid's rant about analogue. Even with modern de-facto controllers like PS2, I usually prefer the digital pad. To me the analogue stick feels like it is a cumbersomely long trek between going in one direction to another. 99% of the time I'm jamming the thing all the way to the edge, so the time it takes to move from one edge to the other is a waste. I know it's silly, but playing a game on a controller like that just feels more tiring. I thought the N64 and dreamcast analogue sticks were suitably small to avoid this.

And analogue buttons? Ugh. Now that's just irritating. Perhaps that was the analogue fad at its peak. I think some PS3 launch titles used this (like racing games) but I'm hoping the trend is dead. And I hate it when a game expects me to click the analogue stick down (like "L3" on a PS3 controller); I trust I'll never get the hang of that without feeling like I'm fumbling around.

My preference is probably just because I play a lot of emulated games. If you remember climbing walls in Ninja Gaiden for the NES, you may understand my preferences in a controller.
You have to calibrate it? I didn't know that. I love Starfighter, and I can control it just fine with my Panasonic brand controller, that I got with my FZ-1.

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Post by Anonymous » Wed Apr 18, 2012 7:45 pm

CasetheCorvetteman wrote:
grimm wrote:
Are we talking the second revision of the first 3DO FZ-1 controller, with headphone jack, or are we talking the redesigned smaller 3DO FZ-10 controller?

Ive so far only had the first 3DO FZ-1 controller, and i like it, but the d-pad is not very nice at all. Diagonals are pretty much impossible with consistancy. That is better on the FZ-10 one. But i do remember reading that the FZ-1 revised controller had a better d-pad. Ive yet to find one though at a price thats worth it, since i want it boxed to be sure its the revised one, in the red/square-design box, and not the black one which is the first.. (if anyone has one for sale, please dont be afraid to contact me, it doesnt have to be boxed if you are sure its the second revision)

I do have a little suggestion though that does help the FZ-1 controller, loosen up the screws a little bit, and the membrane is more responsive letting the d-pad work a little better. At least thats my impression.

As for the original NEO GEO stick, its not perfect, not for people who prefer the western arcade outlay anyway. The buttons are in too steep an angle. Its not so bad you cant use it (its what i use since im NOT paying what people ask for custom joysticks, and i cant build it myself, and the second version seems worse to me), but it is somewhat uncomfortable in games where all 4 buttons are used frequently, as in fighters etc.

But, as for 3DO controllers, try hunting down a megadrive controller adaptor. It is worth it if you can find one, best d-pads in the business, both first-party and third-party, and there is usually one to be found that suits everyones handsize and taste.
Im talking the smaller pad with the round little buttons in the middle. FZ-JP2? id have to pull one out to have a look at the number.

There was no FZ-1 pad and FZ-10 pad as such, cause the later smaller pad came with both the 1 and the 10 ( friend of mine has one, and only has the small pads, bought brand new way back in the day, small pad in the pic on the box too. ). I dont recall the headphone pad coming with the 10 though. I have one here somewhere.

The NEO-GEO stick IS perfect in my opinion, which is all me or anyone else can give, the button angle is spot on and couldnt be better. It allows the hands to rest with wrists at a nice natural and comfortable angle. All 4 buttons are in dead set perfect spots for my fingers and i wouldnt ever want it any other way. Ive got 3 of the 2nd gen sticks, dont like them at all for fighters, not too bad for shooters, first gen stick ive got 4 of, perfect in every way. Control pad with the NEO-CD feels awesome too for a pad, although i havent ever used it to play a game cause mine is brand new and i prefer sticks.

Your hands and playing styles will be different to mine, which is where we have our difference in opinions on what works well for us.

Mega Drive pads are indeed awesome controllers, as are Sega Saturn first generation and Japan version pads. I like both and have a few of each. I havent used the Dreamcast pad much, but not a huge fan of the analog triggers at all.
That the FZ-1 came with the smaller controller was news to me.

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Post by BryWI » Wed Apr 18, 2012 8:58 pm

JohnnyDude wrote: If you remember climbing walls in Ninja Gaiden for the NES...
Do I ever... OH! wait! Properly climbing 2 walls that are near each other? or the ol climbing up the side of the wall trick? lol. I was playing this game a few weeks ago... I still have the NG skillz in me, just not the patience. I made it to the final boss (yes the third one) for the second time before I finally used a save state to finish it. I wasn't going to traverse world 6 for what was probably going to be the third or fourth time. I think I was the only one of all my friends who could beat the game back in the day. Hmm, oops. I return the thread back to it's proper order.

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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Thu Apr 19, 2012 7:19 am

grimm wrote:
That the FZ-1 came with the smaller controller was news to me.
Since this console was bought way back in 1995 or early 96 boxed with that pad id have thought it was pretty much a standard thing... I bought both my FZ-10 and my FZ-10-E used in early 96 and mid 97 respectively, both came with those pads.

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Post by Anonymous » Thu Apr 19, 2012 12:10 pm

CasetheCorvetteman wrote:
grimm wrote:
That the FZ-1 came with the smaller controller was news to me.
Since this console was bought way back in 1995 or early 96 boxed with that pad id have thought it was pretty much a standard thing... I bought both my FZ-10 and my FZ-10-E used in early 96 and mid 97 respectively, both came with those pads.
Yeah the FZ-10 came with those.

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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Fri Apr 20, 2012 12:43 pm

You dont say.... That is what i said!!!

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Post by Anonymous » Fri Apr 20, 2012 1:05 pm

CasetheCorvetteman wrote:You dont say.... That is what i said!!!
I was simply agreeing with you, calm down a bit.

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Post by 3DOKid » Fri Apr 20, 2012 8:55 pm

JohnnyDude wrote: I half agree with 3DO Kid's rant about analogue.

Half Agree? I take it you never read the forums small print?














;)

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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:32 am

grimm wrote:
CasetheCorvetteman wrote:You dont say.... That is what i said!!!
I was simply agreeing with you, calm down a bit.
Im always calm these days, getting uptight is a thing of the past i reckon... ;)

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Post by Anonymous » Sat Apr 21, 2012 8:40 am

CasetheCorvetteman wrote:
grimm wrote:
CasetheCorvetteman wrote:You dont say.... That is what i said!!!
I was simply agreeing with you, calm down a bit.
Im always calm these days, getting uptight is a thing of the past i reckon... ;)
3(!) exclamation marks would insinuate differently, but alright then. either way im dropping this now.

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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Sat Apr 21, 2012 9:02 am

You can take it any way you like my friend, cause i dont care too much either way ;) Its your problem if youre that up tight, not mine :lol: :lol:

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Post by Anonymous » Sat Apr 21, 2012 1:38 pm

CasetheCorvetteman wrote:You can take it any way you like my friend, cause i dont care too much either way ;) Its your problem if youre that up tight, not mine :lol: :lol:
I said i would drop it, and your response just says it all. Be difficult then. *shrugs* Think ill stop paying notice to this thread all together.

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Post by JohnnyDude » Sat Apr 21, 2012 1:56 pm

3DOKid wrote:
JohnnyDude wrote: I half agree with 3DO Kid's rant about analogue.

Half Agree? I take it you never read the forums small print?














;)
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Post by CasetheCorvetteman » Sat Apr 21, 2012 2:16 pm

grimm wrote:
CasetheCorvetteman wrote:You can take it any way you like my friend, cause i dont care too much either way ;) Its your problem if youre that up tight, not mine :lol: :lol:
I said i would drop it, and your response just says it all. Be difficult then. *shrugs* Think ill stop paying notice to this thread all together.
Nothing at all difficult about it!!! :lol:

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Post by dave4shmups » Sun Apr 22, 2012 6:56 pm

Do you have to calibrate the flight stick differently for every 3DO game that uses it?? That would be a pain, IMO.

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Post by 3DOKid » Sun Apr 22, 2012 9:42 pm

JohnnyDude wrote:
Must - agree - with - all 3DOKid's rants - can't - resist

Yes - Dynarri - I - wish - to - know - about - flowers.

I - wish - to - go - now
I LOL'd.

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Post by dave4shmups » Tue Apr 24, 2012 12:41 am

dave4shmups wrote:Do you have to calibrate the flight stick differently for every 3DO game that uses it?? That would be a pain, IMO.
So, do you?

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Post by Anonymous » Tue Apr 24, 2012 3:56 pm

dave4shmups wrote:
dave4shmups wrote:Do you have to calibrate the flight stick differently for every 3DO game that uses it?? That would be a pain, IMO.
So, do you?
If i recall correctly, yes. But its easy, you just turn a couple of wheels basically.

Ive only used mine with WC3.

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