Kobayashi Maru - Final - Released

It does float! And doesn't get soggy in milk! :)

Moderator: a31chris

Post Reply
User avatar
sneth
Nibbler
Posts: 425
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:31 pm
Location: STL
Contact:

Kobayashi Maru - Final - Released

Post by sneth » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:49 am

http://www.rgcd.co.uk/2012/12/kobayashi ... atari.html

It's essentially a Time Pilot clone, which is friggin awesome. I was a Time Pilot ace, so I'm pretty excited for this.

It doesn't push the system to it's limits, but it's colorful and polished.
Hopefully the Reboot team will be able to crank these out with their engine.

It's CD based so you could probably find an ISO, but I try to support these people the best I can. So buy it.

Anonymous

Post by Anonymous » Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:25 am

Whilst i support all homebrew efforts on retro consoles, i wish some were a bit more complex than things like this. Not saying this game cant be fun, or that every homebrew game has to be a Battlesphere or a Pier Solar, but it would be fun to see a complete and original homebrew with ambition to be a little more than just an arcade rip-off.

Again, since people tend to take anything thats not praise on homebrew as pissing on it, i am NOT pissing on this effort. Just wish people with the knowledge and ability to make games, also had the time and effort to make something more complex. Then again, Atari's strong point always were arcade games, but the jaguar is capable of so much more.

Good with a new game for those with the Jag CD none the less.

User avatar
Lemmi
3DO ZERO USER
Posts: 1189
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2007 11:10 pm
Location: Mich

Post by Lemmi » Wed Dec 19, 2012 2:45 am

ok ill piss on it then, i would rather pay $5 for the atari cart than pay for that, but since i sold my jag cd this doesnt bother me :P
Ex-3DO collector extraordinaire , but i still have my collection
Villagephotos is dead, need to find my old pics and find another host

User avatar
sneth
Nibbler
Posts: 425
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:31 pm
Location: STL
Contact:

Post by sneth » Wed Dec 19, 2012 3:35 am

It's a massive task to make anything run on the Jaguar.

This was a just a demo that they polished up due to positive remarks and demand. It was also made with their Reboot engine, so it's a good example of the kind of game that can be made. They have a lot of working tech demo's.

Keep in mind the Atari community in general are fans of arcade style games. Most of their library is arcade style.

Shame on you guys. lol

Anonymous

Post by Anonymous » Wed Dec 19, 2012 1:55 pm

I take no shame in expressing my opinion. Even if you did mean it jokingly.

User avatar
Lemmi
3DO ZERO USER
Posts: 1189
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2007 11:10 pm
Location: Mich

Post by Lemmi » Wed Dec 19, 2012 8:08 pm

heh i dont mind these games, i did after all buy Beef Drop for the 7800 which is a burgertime clone. the only reason i would buy this game is for name only, not into time pilot that much... lol
Ex-3DO collector extraordinaire , but i still have my collection
Villagephotos is dead, need to find my old pics and find another host

Anonymous

Post by Anonymous » Wed Dec 19, 2012 9:39 pm

I would consider it, had it been a cartridge release. I did get Blackout! in the second release batch.. Its not my type of game ive come to realize, but i wanted to support the effort, and if i decide to sell i will at least not lose money on it i think.

Like i said, i try to support homebrew releases when my economy permits.

User avatar
sneth
Nibbler
Posts: 425
Joined: Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:31 pm
Location: STL
Contact:

Post by sneth » Wed Dec 19, 2012 11:10 pm

I think the limitations on carts is price. There has been some huge progress on this front, but it's still not very friendly on the wallet.

User avatar
3DO Experience
3DO ZONE ADMIN
Posts: 3686
Joined: Sun Jun 24, 2007 8:47 am
Location: U.S.A.

Post by 3DO Experience » Thu Dec 20, 2012 12:15 am

Is it bad that I know the title is a reference to Star Trek?
"Wait. You don't have a bag of charcoal in your gaming room???"

Anonymous

Post by Anonymous » Thu Dec 20, 2012 2:25 am

Mission simulation in Star Trek right?

Actually, id pay the higher price for a cartridge release any day compared to a cd-r release. Especially since i dont even HAVE a Jag CD yet, and the laser unit in that would be difficult if not impossible to replace once the cd-r has worn it out prematurely. If it was pressed, then sure, id use it like any other original release for the Jag CD.. The cd-r really puts me off using them in old laser units. Which is why i really dont use my 3DO much for VCD duties, it wears out the laser unit quicker.

User avatar
Lemmi
3DO ZERO USER
Posts: 1189
Joined: Sat Jan 13, 2007 11:10 pm
Location: Mich

Post by Lemmi » Thu Dec 20, 2012 4:18 am

3DO Experience wrote:Is it bad that I know the title is a reference to Star Trek?
is it worse that i just got done watching Star Trek (the JJ one) because of this thread? ;)
Ex-3DO collector extraordinaire , but i still have my collection
Villagephotos is dead, need to find my old pics and find another host

User avatar
sh3-rg
3DO ZERO USER
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:16 pm
Location: North West England
Contact:

re: Kobayashi Maru:Final

Post by sh3-rg » Sat Dec 22, 2012 10:43 pm

Sorry if this is an epic post, I just want to reply to the whole thread at once rather than spam it with multiple posts.
sneth wrote:http://www.rgcd.co.uk/2012/12/kobayashi ... atari.html

It's essentially a Time Pilot clone, which is friggin awesome. I was a Time Pilot ace, so I'm pretty excited for this.

It doesn't push the system to it's limits, but it's colorful and polished.
Hopefully the Reboot team will be able to crank these out with their engine.

It's CD based so you could probably find an ISO, but I try to support these people the best I can. So buy it.
Thanks, sneth, for your thread & kind words! I'm not sure if I know you from another forum under another name or if you only do your Jaguar talk here, either way, I appreciate it :D I don't think anyone has imaged and uploaded it yet, but I was actually googling for exactly that when I found this thread.
grimm wrote:Not saying this game cant be fun, or that every homebrew game has to be a Battlesphere or a Pier Solar, but it would be fun to see a complete and original homebrew with ambition to be a little more than just an arcade rip-off.
Well Battlesphere was a commercially produced title and Pier Solar is probably the one of if not the stand-out homebrew title on any system. It had a large team (dozens of people involved) and many man-hours put into it, and now it's becoming an indie game for many other systems.

As for rip-off, that's a bit unfair. If we took Time Pilot, decompiled it, ripped assets and recreated it on Jaguar and called it Time Pilot - that would be a rip off. Of course TP inspired our game, it is a clone, that's not such a bad thing, especially in homebrew circles (look at the 7800 homebrews - many of them are direct copies of games... and the 7800 people like that... we're of a similar opinion but like to do things our own way).

As for us, we're two people, a coder and a gfxer, plus a few testers, who spend a few hours a week (if we're lucky!) doing something we enjoy :-) We see ourselves just the same as the guys who make new 7800 games and new 2600 games - those are the kinds of games we like and always have. Just because it's the Jaguar and "64-bit powa" doesn't mean you have to make games of a certain type or percieved level technically.

Innovation in the gaming experience, new ideas and fresh thinking - that's not generally the realm of homebrews for 20 year old dead consoles. Look at commercial games and look at indie studios, and look at cutting edge hardware - that's where this kind of stuff can take place - where people will see rewards for such efforts and skills.
grimm wrote:the jaguar is capable of so much more.
What the Jaguar is actually capable of is seen in the finished, completed games that people have on their shelves. Anything else is talk, speculation, tech demos and also the favourite subject of the kinds of guys who weirdly never actually get around to releasing a finished product to prove any of the theories ;-)

http://reboot.atari.org/new-reboot/about.html

Read that. We're not Jaguar game makers because we're trying to prove points to anyone or prove what the Jaguar was or could have been. That's best left to those who give a shit ;-) We just know what it was designed to let you do easily - is all the lovely OP sprite handling stuff, probably all the original Atari Panther style stuff before Flair II added the techno :P We're all about having fun making stuff and giving it away for free when we can.
grimm wrote:I would consider it, had it been a cartridge release.
Cartridges are best left to the kinds of games that require them - ie larger than 2mb single-load titles and those that benefit from the ROM space. KM:F is a single-load, <2mb binary and runs from memory alone - that's how it was designed so it could be played by anyone with a BJL, Jaguar CD, skunkboard, etc. We won't throw such a game onto a cart just because we can, it makes little sense - the CD medium is the perfect and most cost-effective for this one. What is also does is allow for better music and that's something we'll explore in future releases.

Also, it should be pointed out Kobayashi Maru:Final is actually a slight remix of a game that (like all our other game releases for Jaguar and Falcon) can be freely downloaded and played with a flash device or Jag CD. Buying our games supports our Jaguar activities, everything we have ever made from selling Jaguar games (which isn't exaclty loads!) has all gone directly back into our Jaguar game making... for instance, our SFDX release and small ejagfest releases paid for a JagCD unit for CJ and 500 carts chells for future games... the CD Unit CJ bought in turn lead to us making improvments to the Jagtopia free boot CD and memory track support...
sneth wrote:I think the limitations on carts is price. There has been some huge progress on this front, but it's still not very friendly on the wallet.
That's a big part of it. We have a 4mb flash cart design and have produced prototypes to be sure they work as intended. You're right though, they're not cheap (around 25 euros a piece as long as we purchase sufficient quantity at the price point)... then there's boxes, stickers, manuals, overlays, box inserts... it all adds up quickly. Our first cartridge game will be Rebooteroids: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8Dwlr4wHDXE One of the reasons we're going to be producing these CD games over the coming months is to try to raise a little cash to help fund the initial cart release.
3DO Experience wrote:Is it bad that I know the title is a reference to Star Trek?
Not at all :-) The kobayashi maru was an impossible task, CJ liked the name as there is no way to complete or win our game - you keep shooting as long as you can until you're dead :-) But you can cheat like Kirk did if you know how :P
grimm wrote:Actually, id pay the higher price for a cartridge release any day compared to a cd-r release.
Kobayashi Maru:Final is supplied on a glass mastered/metal stamped real CD, not a CD-R. As I said earlier, if the game requires a cart that's fine, if not, CD is far less of a financial risk or burden for all involved... if there were more Jaguar fans and more willing to buy CD games, they could be sold at a much, much lower price point, when you glass master a game you have to take a minimum quantity that is far more than you could ever hope to sell but you have to base your end price on what you will see back in sales... all the kind of stuff we hate to be involved with tbh, that's why we've teamed up with RGCD.co.uk to make this happen :-)
grimm wrote:and the laser unit in that would be difficult if not impossible to replace once the cd-r has worn it out prematurely.
It's actually fairly straight forward to replace a Jaguar CD mech, I've done it twice using LinkoVitch's guide.

...

Again, sorry for the epic tl;dr post :P

User avatar
Austin
Master Poster & Pricing Expert
Posts: 1836
Joined: Sun Dec 20, 2009 11:30 am
Location: Fairfax, VA
Contact:

Post by Austin » Sat Dec 22, 2012 11:04 pm

Welcome to the forum, Sh3! Shame there's no +1 system in place here, otherwise I would. :P

User avatar
Trev
3DO ZONE MOD
Posts: 4033
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 7:19 pm
Location: States
Contact:

Post by Trev » Sun Dec 23, 2012 5:38 am

Welcome to the forum sh3-rg. I enjoyed your post, and hope that you'll consider sticking around to talk more. We need more Jag discussions here, and chat from developers is always exciting.

I like the watching your vid of rebooteroids. How close is it to completion? Also, will their be any in game tracks, or just music at the title screen?

Glad you joined us. Wishing you success in your homebrew efforts. :)
Most wanted - Eye of Typhoon, 3DO Magazines issues #14 & #15, Pro Stadium, Defcon 5

User avatar
sh3-rg
3DO ZERO USER
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:16 pm
Location: North West England
Contact:

Post by sh3-rg » Sun Dec 23, 2012 1:36 pm

Trev wrote:Welcome to the forum sh3-rg. I enjoyed your post, and hope that you'll consider sticking around to talk more. We need more Jag discussions here, and chat from developers is always exciting.
Hey, if I'd known there was somewhere else to talk Jaguar I'd have been here sooner! I've even been known to gate-crash the French and German forums when I've felt the need to stick my oar in :P
Trev wrote:I like the watching your vid of rebooteroids. How close is it to completion? Also, will their be any in game tracks, or just music at the title screen?
At the moment there are no actually levels in the game (what you see in the video is just my attempt to throw some stuff together before the ejagfest so we coudl better demonstrate how the game has changed since last time it was shown). There will be in-game music, we hope. There's an awful lot of RMW graphics going on there and it absolutely batters the bus to the point where we're right on the limit of it dropping to 25/30fps from 50/60, but we have a custom sound engine and an expert mod musician and are reasonably confident we can make it happen.

We're also currently exploring more game modes that will be unlocks as you progress, actually discussing another exciting one right now as I type ;-)
Trev wrote:Glad you joined us. Wishing you success in your homebrew efforts. :)
Cheers, Trev, appreciate those kinds of comments!

Anonymous

Post by Anonymous » Sun Dec 23, 2012 1:48 pm

For what it worth, i dont use undertones. Beleive it or not.

To elaborate a little on the word rip-off. It can actually become better that what was ripped off, if the idea is improved upon, perfected or whatever. Rip-off to me does not mean what it means to you, evidently. It can be a respectfully made homage as much as a really lazy effort to grab attention or money. To me, Saints Row is an obvious rip-off of Grand Theft Auto, but they have expanded, diversified and made it original from the original concept. And Saints Row 3 is hilarious and a great game. But a rip-off one the less.
Last edited by Anonymous on Sun Dec 23, 2012 1:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
sh3-rg
3DO ZERO USER
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:16 pm
Location: North West England
Contact:

Post by sh3-rg » Sun Dec 23, 2012 1:55 pm

grimm wrote:For what it worth, i dont use undertones. Beleive it or not.
Lighten up fella, I'm just explaining how that word comes across to a native English speaker. For example, anyone over the age of 60 in the UK will know and love this ossum TV show: http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b00wck32 Rip Off Britain, where three Golden Girls race around the country uncovering plots and scams to relieve everyday folk of their hard-earned cashmoneys :mrgreen:

Image

Anonymous

Post by Anonymous » Sun Dec 23, 2012 1:56 pm

Im not upset, so no need to lighten up? Again, dont look for undertones.

What you just posted is more akin to fraud to me.

User avatar
sh3-rg
3DO ZERO USER
Posts: 18
Joined: Sat Dec 22, 2012 9:16 pm
Location: North West England
Contact:

Post by sh3-rg » Sun Dec 23, 2012 2:00 pm

grimm wrote:What you just posted is more akin to fraud to me.
Exactly - that is how the term "rip off" is used by them and the rest of the nation to mean fraud. But you know, I feel we're getting away from the thread topic possibly... although if anyone wants to discuss our trio of Golden Girls, I'm only a PM away ;-)

Anonymous

Post by Anonymous » Sun Dec 23, 2012 2:03 pm

As long as you dont read in undertones in what i type, im content. As for those "golden girls", i use my own common sense and it has protected me from getting defrauded so far, dont really need their help. But you are right. back to topic.

User avatar
Trev
3DO ZONE MOD
Posts: 4033
Joined: Thu Jan 25, 2007 7:19 pm
Location: States
Contact:

Post by Trev » Mon Dec 24, 2012 5:37 am

sh3-rg wrote:
Trev wrote:Welcome to the forum sh3-rg. I enjoyed your post, and hope that you'll consider sticking around to talk more. We need more Jag discussions here, and chat from developers is always exciting.
Hey, if I'd known there was somewhere else to talk Jaguar I'd have been here sooner! I've even been known to gate-crash the French and German forums when I've felt the need to stick my oar in :P
Ha ha, that's awesome. The Jag scene on these boards has been pretty quiet of late (probably cause it's buried under the 3DO banner) so it's great to have new blood and new projects too!
Most wanted - Eye of Typhoon, 3DO Magazines issues #14 & #15, Pro Stadium, Defcon 5

Post Reply