Slayer

[Martin III]

I find it's better to wait until your opinion is fully formed before starting. I'm not one of those guys who begins writing a review before he's even played the game through.

I was just testing out the feature alluded to in the "Playing Games Wrong" thread by restarting my original dungeon with all the levels and items my character gained on his first run, and I made a couple chance discoveries. Both relate to hit/miss outcomes, so Trev may be particularly interested.

First, apparently the manual wasn't lying about level affecting THAC. I went through the entirety of floors 1, 2, and 3 with 100% hit accuracy! It felt good one-shotting all those nasties who gave me trouble the first time around. And since I'm pretty sure I haven't added any major dexterity-boosting equipment since those first five floors, that leaves my level ups as the only explanation for my increased accuracy.

Second, at one point I was fighting a gargoyle at the outside corner of a room. The wall was only taking up the left 1/4 of the screen, but apparently it was blocking our attacks, because we both were consistently missing. I moved away from the room and the problem was immediately solved. So, something to look out for there.

[Trev]

I was just testing out the feature alluded to in the "Playing Games Wrong" thread by restarting my original dungeon with all the levels and items my character gained on his first run, and I made a couple chance discoveries. Both relate to hit/miss outcomes, so Trev may be particularly interested.

You know I am interested.

I agree w/3DOExp, you should post a review of Slayer. Do it quick too, cause I'm about to bump my own Slayer review w/new pics.

[3DO Experience]

I agree w/3DOExp, you should post a review of Slayer. Do it quick too, cause I'm about to bump my own Slayer review w/new pics.

He's bluffing, he didn't write a review to bump.

[Trev]

I agree w/3DOExp, you should post a review of Slayer. Do it quick too, cause I'm about to bump my own Slayer review w/new pics.

He's bluffing, he didn't write a review to bump.

Calling my bluff? Keep it up and I may even bump the Slayer review that you posted.

[Martin III]

I agree w/3DOExp, you should post a review of Slayer. Do it quick too, cause I'm about to bump my own Slayer review w/new pics.

He's bluffing, he didn't write a review to bump.

It sure looks like he has a review of it up here... Was he just posting it for someone else?

[Trev]

I agree w/3DOExp, you should post a review of Slayer. Do it quick too, cause I'm about to bump my own Slayer review w/new pics.

He's bluffing, he didn't write a review to bump.

It sure looks like he has a review of it up here... Was he just posting it for someone else?

All my reviews are my own ... if I were to post for someone else, you would probably know do to the increase in quality of the writing.

Anyway, I am gonna give my Slayer review a bump as soon as I play a bit more (already have the screenshots picked out)

Btw, I forgot to mention that Towers II for the Atari Jaguar (1996?) is another dungeon crawler that appears to display weapons during combat (shame one me since we have a Jag section in these very forums!) Basing this off youtube vids only ... haven't played it yet, and not sure if it is worth the price.

[Austin]

Towers II on the Jag is pretty good IMO. Seems to be a lot of people that dislike it heavily though. Clearly not worth the price either way (they go for $100+ these days), but it's still good if you're into these kinds of dungeon crawlers.

[Martin III]

Btw, I forgot to mention that Towers II for the Atari Jaguar (1996?)

Yep, December 1996. Over two years after Slayer, yet it isn't even half as graphically impressive.

Personally, I decided to pass on Towers II when I saw (via YouTube videos) how bland and poor the graphics are. The gameplay could be good, but the dungeon layout and the use of a mouse pointer which can only be controlled by D-pad don't look promising. Being the dungeon lover I am, I'd probably enjoy it, but there are plenty of other unplayed dungeon crawlers out there that I'd enjoy far more.

[Martin III]

Anybody know how the save data works with regard to custom-made characters? Does it retain every character you create, or does it overwrite your previous character each time you create a new one?

I'm asking because I want to try the game with a different character next, but I also want to eventually play through a Hard mode dungeon with my original cleric. Will he be lost if I create a new character? What about if I start a new dungeon with one of the preset characters?

[3DO Experience]

I don't know if the game overwrites characters but I was sitting at work and thought if you have the Game Guru just make a copy of your save file. You can then name it for the character on it and you'll have a copy in case it does overwrite.

[Martin III]

What's the Game Guru? I just checked the 3DO FAQ on GameFAQs, but it doesn't really talk about it.

[3DO Experience]

Wow. The Game Guru is like a Game Genie for the 3DO. It alters save game files to apply cheats and unlock sections of games (via hex editing). It's also a great tool as it can compress save files giving you room for more saves and there are many other manipulations you can do with it. Like I mentioned before you can make duplicates of save files letting you play around with the original.

[Trev]

The Game Guru is great.

[Martin III]

Anybody know how the save data works with regard to custom-made characters? Does it retain every character you create, or does it overwrite your previous character each time you create a new one?

I'm asking because I want to try the game with a different character next, but I also want to eventually play through a Hard mode dungeon with my original cleric. Will he be lost if I create a new character? What about if I start a new dungeon with one of the preset characters?

It's been over a year, but I finally got around to finding the answer to this. Basically, yes, Slayer only reserves one slot for custom-made characters.

However, one important point: It does not overwrite that slot when you create a new character, but only when you save a game with the new character. On my first run with a new character, I got killed before I managed to do anything worth saving. Back at the main menu, I selected "choose character" and found that my original custom character was still there, and my newly created character was gone. This means that you can play with a new character without losing your old one, so long as you don't save - not very useful on an actual 3DO, but possibly a good trick to have for emulation, where you can use save states to save your progress through a dungeon.

Now I just need to confirm whether it retains your custom character if you start a new dungeon with a preset character.

[Martin III]

Hmm, I thought that might have sparked more interest.

Well, I forgot to mention that this game is still awesome. I'm using a half-elf fighter/mage this time, and having a blast trying out all the mage spells, since the first time I went with a cleric. For some reason, lightning seems to consistently slaughter monster hides much better than fire, despite the spells being the same level. Ice Storm is also a cool spell. And it's entirely too much fun having an arsenal of offensive spells to rely on for all those monster that are either immune to physical attacks or have a ridiculously high armor rating.

I've had my first encounter with gelatinous cubes. I must say, it looks like the developers took a few photos of a gelatin mold and digitized them... Is it possible that this really is how they got the graphic for this monster?

I also met Ettins for the first time. For some reason, one level had them as the sole monsters. A whole level full of those terrors was quite the thrill. More dangerous (and louder!) than other foes, but they go down more quickly too. I came out of that scene with my heart pounding and a big grin on my face.

Short version: It's awesome how many new things you can experience in Slayer on a second playthrough.

[Martin III]

I seem to have hit a glitch...

Okay, so I got to level 14, inhabited by mindflayers and fire elementals. Those fire elementals just keep on picking on the wrong guys; on my first playthrough it was a character with fire resistance spells, and now they're trying to get someone with a fire resistance amulet and two powerful cold spells. They just never learn. :) The mindflayers are a nastier threat, but I'd been hoarding two speed potions so I figured it was high time to use one of them. Add on that this level was very open, with almost no enclosed rooms, and I was able to clear the place of enemies in under 20 minutes. Honestly, it was a total slaughterfest.

So at last I go to the exit door, which is on the North wall. On that same square is a switch (for raising part of the floor). The glitch is, even when I'm facing the North wall, pressing C only causes my character to touch the switch. No matter which way I face, I can't get him to interact with the exit. This is really frustrating, as I had only one more level left to go.

Any suggestions? Can the 3DO Game Guru get me out of this?

[Martin III]

Now I just need to confirm whether it retains your custom character if you start a new dungeon with a preset character.

A month later, and I've finally checked this out. No, it does not retain your custom character. I guess that space in the save file is used for your preset character's current stats.

[T2KFreeker]

Wow, I need to check this part of the forum more often. Looks like you are picking apart one of my favorite games. Slayer is amazing. My buds and I were just talking about this game and Deathkeep as we were playing it the other day. Yup, I had a 3DO session here at the house. If it means anything, we have decided that Slayer is the more playable of the two games. Even on easy, Deathkeep can be a nightmare to play. Don't know why they felt the need to ramp up the difficulty that high, but it has it's moments. Have you beaten Slayer yet?

[Martin III]

I beat it on my original playthrough. The last one I had to give up on due to the glitch mentioned here; I've since deleted that file. Good to hear that you're a fellow enthusiast of the game!

I haven't had a chance to dig into Deathkeep yet. I'm a little disappointed with how much they reduced the character customization, but it looks like a cool sequel.

[T2KFreeker]

I beat it on my original playthrough. The last one I had to give up on due to the glitch mentioned here; I've since deleted that file. Good to hear that you're a fellow enthusiast of the game!

I haven't had a chance to dig into Deathkeep yet. I'm a little disappointed with how much they reduced the character customization, but it looks like a cool sequel.

It is a well built game though and the dungeon designs are both good, and completely brutal. Just make sure you are ready to die a lot until you get used to it. LOL

[OfManNotMachine]

Slayer is one of my all time favorite games!

Random levels every time you play.

Death Keep was such a let down. Why they decided to abandon the random level feature is beyond me.

Interstingly...Slayer was originally made as a technical demo to showcase what the 3DO could do.

[Martin III]

[quote="OfManNotMachine"]Slayer is one of my all time favorite games!

Random levels every time you play.

Death Keep was such a let down. Why they decided to abandon the random level feature is beyond me.[/quote]

There's a lot of hate out there for random level generators, sadly... It seems many people like being able to anticipate what you're going to encounter within a game. And to be fair, the random level feature has been poorly applied in some games (Robotica springs to mind). But yeah, I love the random levels in Slayer. It makes replaying the game so much more exciting.

[Trev]

[quote="Martin III"][quote="OfManNotMachine"]Slayer is one of my all time favorite games!

Random levels every time you play.

Death Keep was such a let down. Why they decided to abandon the random level feature is beyond me.[/quote]

There's a lot of hate out there for random level generators, sadly... It seems many people like being able to anticipate what you're going to encounter within a game. And to be fair, the random level feature has been poorly applied in some games (Robotica springs to mind). But yeah, I love the random levels in Slayer. It makes replaying the game so much more exciting.[/quote]

I agree. Death Keep was a step backwards ditching the random level generator! Slayer did it right, w/a ton of options and customization. It's the better game for it imho.

[OfManNotMachine]

I think people who dont want random levels n such are most of todays gamers who dont have any desire to be challenged.

It really seems that so many gamers today just dont want to be challenged.
Games today will hold your hand the entire way through and I think that sucks.
I wanna be challeneged. Whats the point of playin a game if you just know flat out you wont fail.

Slayer is like a different game everytime you play. I love that.

[a31chris]

[quote="Trev"][quote="Martin III"][quote="OfManNotMachine"]Slayer is one of my all time favorite games!

Random levels every time you play.

Death Keep was such a let down. Why they decided to abandon the random level feature is beyond me.[/quote]

There's a lot of hate out there for random level generators, sadly... It seems many people like being able to anticipate what you're going to encounter within a game. And to be fair, the random level feature has been poorly applied in some games (Robotica springs to mind). But yeah, I love the random levels in Slayer. It makes replaying the game so much more exciting.[/quote]

I agree. Death Keep was a step backwards ditching the random level generator! Slayer did it right, w/a ton of options and customization. It's the better game for it imho.[/quote]

I dont like the random level generator because its impersonal. I like the personal touches in games like this. The actual human thought that went into the design. Its exploring someone else's imagination.
Random level generator is impersonal to me and not really something that makes to me, a game replayable. Everything is the same, just in different rooms. And the room layout is different. IMO that is not that huge of a deal. When I replay D2 because I lost my save games I dont think WOW this layout is different than last time! To me it does not really phase me I guess.

[Martin III]

[quote="a31chris"]I dont like the random level generator because its impersonal. I like the personal touches in games like this. The actual human thought that went into the design. Its exploring someone else's imagination.
Random level generator is impersonal to me and not really something that makes to me, a game replayable. Everything is the same, just in different rooms. And the room layout is different. IMO that is not that huge of a deal. When I replay D2 because I lost my save games I dont think WOW this layout is different than last time! To me it does not really phase me I guess.[/quote]

It makes a difference in Slayer for several reasons:

1.The value of items in the game is EXTREMELY variable. A weapon or piece of armor that turns one character into a juggernaut is unequippable by another. A magic orb which is useful to one character is redundant to another. And regardless of what class you are, rations are a blessing, water is useless, and speed potions allow you a few minutes of rampant slaughter.
2.Enemies have drastically different abilities from one another, and there are enough of them that it takes multiple playthroughs just to encounter every member of the menagerie, much less encounter them under the same circumstances.
3.Somehow, the random level generator in Slayer manages to create non-generic situations. For example, as noted a while back, I once encountered three enemies clustered on the lone square of ceiling above a teleporter.
4.This is an obvious one: The final boss varies. This alone is often considered a motivation to replay games without random level generators.
5.Enemies have strengths and weakness which correspond to specific classes or characters and specific items, both of which also change in each playthrough.

There are probably more that I'm not thinking of. But yeah, it's definitely not "Everything is the same, just in different rooms."

[OfManNotMachine]

Those are fair points for sure, I never thought bought playing someone's vision n such. That's a good point.

[NeoGeoNinja]

@Martiniii

I've been following this thread and watched some vids on YouTube. Will probably pick this up at some point vs price ;)

Have you ever heard of or seen Towers II on the Jaguar? Thats what Slayer reminded me of.

I think you'd dig it :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOVRC8gkOTU

[Martin III]

[quote="NeoGeoNinja"]@Martiniii

I've been following this thread and watched some vids on YouTube. Will probably pick this up at some point vs price ;)

Have you ever heard of or seen Towers II on the Jaguar? Thats what Slayer reminded me of.

I think you'd dig it :)

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=VOVRC8gkOTU[/quote]

Yep, Towers II was discussed farther up this thread. Besides the reasons I mentioned for my relative lack of interest in it, I don't have a Jaguar! (And really, I have a ton of first person dungeon crawlers to check out. I haven't even played Dungeon Master or Eye of the Beholder yet!)

[mikemacdee]

I got a new 3DO for Christmas to replace the problematic old one for the time being, and Slayer was one of my new purchases for the 3DO library. I've been playing all night two nights in a row, getting the feel for how the game works, and I'm still learning how to Slay it seems.

My current run is with pretty mage Zelda Molina: I threw her into a dungeon with the seed "Lovecraft" and the "bug" monster theme to see what came of it. In true Lovecraftian fashion, I've gone from "powerful mage kicking ass and taking names with artifacts and arcane knowledge" to "running screaming and crying through the halls as giant unkillable horrors chase me like the boogeyman." I'm now halfway through the dungeon and stalked by giant bloodworms with THAC0 I simply can't hit with anything -- not even the flame magic they're supposedly weak to. I deprived every floor of its loot and monster up to this point, and despite all my experience I'm suddenly in a real pickle. Shoulda kept a spare Orb of True Seeing...